From The Archive: Interview with Glenn Donaldson
The Reds, Pinks & Purples
Glenn has written more songs than you.
This interview was transcribed from the April 12, 2024 episode of The Go-Go Radio Magic Show, which originally aired on CJLO 1690AM
GGRMS: So first question is how San Francisco?
Glenn Donaldson: Well, it's rainy. It's been like a cold and kind of rainy winter for us. It's not compared to Canada or wherever else people are. It's not that cold, but for us it's cold.
GGRMS: Right. Well, I read that the weather was quite severe in California and I feel like every time I speak to you, you guys had just been hit by a hurricane or some sort of tropical storm or something. So it's nice to hear that it's just wet and cold.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, there's been a couple of storms. Maybe not as bad as last year, but yeah, iit's been wet.
GGRMS: All right, well, I have a lot of questions about The Town That Cursed Your Name….so I suggest we start there … I was wondering if the sound behind The Town That Cursed Your Name was a reaction to Summer At Land’s End ?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, that's probably true. I felt like Summer At Land's End… That was that was my gauzy acoustic record. And then I brought out my big muff for the town that cursed your name. I just get sort of bored of the same sounds and I have a limited kind of style and I keep it really simple, but the things I can change about it are the textures. And yeah, I was, I think I wanted to make a record that referenced like my college rock side more. You know, I grew up in that era and like Hüsker Dü is my favorite band of all time probably. So there's a little bit of that in there, but you know, I don't try to sound like Hüsker Dü and I don't at all, but it's like filtered through my Reds Pink and Purple style.
GGRMS: When The Reds, Pinks and Purples started, you were talking about how you assembled the albums, and in fact it was, buddy at the label that was sort of picking and choosing and assembling the track list. Since then, It seems your albums have become more conceptual. Was this album pieced together the same way as the earlier albums or was this an album that was sort of mapped out and written to be a whole.?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, I started taking that part more seriously. Yes, Summer at Land's End I did very deliberately as a concept. And yeah, I guess everything since then I've been a little bit more conscientious about having a theme or grouping songs around a sonic idea. I did that digital record called Still Clouds at Noon. That one's coming out in vinyl as well. Later on this year. And yeah, that was fully conceptual where I just wanted to make a certain kind of record a slower tempo record. And I just did all the songs in one week basically kept kept the sound really uniform. Yeah, The Town That Cursed Your Name, I started noticing I was writing all these songs about, you know, it's almost a concept album really about trying to be an artist trying to music business and how kind of low rent the indie rock world is and how badly people can be treated and how badly people treat each other. But then also the glory of it to the small victories that happen and the connections that get made.
GGRMS: So a song like Life in the Void is probably a song that a lot of my musician or artist friends can relate to where you're clocking your nine to five job thinking about what you'd rather be doing which is probably writing music.
Glenn Donaldson: So I'm going to talk about that track a little bit. That was the, if I'm not mistaken, it came or materialized first as a single on bandcamp, and then was it absorbed into the album afterwards. The song was kind of a surprise. I wanted to write a rock song. So I feel like I'm known for writing wimpy pop songs and I was like, maybe I'll write a rocker. And I made that beat. And I just kind of played that riff and it's probably the most, yeah, I guess it's the most rocking. Maybe you could tell me it's kind of a rock song, right? It's got a riff rather than a kind of folk chord change, although it's got some of the same elements that all my songs do. In my mind, it was this rockin track and I was pretty excited about it. So yeah, it needed more, it needed kind of a gritty topic and, Life IN The Void , I had that title and it seems gritty . I write about having a job and working an hourly wage and all that stuff is completely from my experience. I'm singing about it completely authentically, although the ironic thing is I recently quit working just to work on music. So yeah, the ironic thing is that I have been writing songs about, you know, having to balance work and music and and now I won and I'm not working anymore, except for myself.
GGRMS: Congratulations.
Glenn Donaldson: Thanks. But yeah, that that song has a lot going on in it. I feel like it's a little short story as well about about someone probably that I know or someone that type of person that we know. Yeah, the middle section. that's about working and and not being valued for work and which you can be valued as an employee, but but when it comes down to it, they don't really care about you. They want you to think that they're your family but they're really just gonna shit on you and throw you out as soon as they don't need you. I feel like it also comes down to the lottery of like who your supervisor is or who holds that position between you and like whoever the upper power is because I mean if they're a nice person sometimes they can smooth the road for us but you're kind of wonderful. If you can make connections to people you work with and have a human connection and have do something that's meaningful or have a meaningful mission at your work but also just remember they do not care about you. They're not your family. They're not your partner, but they want you to think that they are which is a bizarre and insidious part of capitalism at least here in the United States that's very much the tone of of employment here and it's it's really grotesque and. So I'm always reacting to that. Well, psychological warfare that's going on in capitalism in America let's say. Just just as a tangent of that.
GGRMS: The idea that you've, you're now working on your music full time. I think as fans we've all been sort of wondering if that was going to happen. You know, it's part of the story arc of The Reds, Pinks and Purples.
Glenn Donaldson: I like that. I kind of thought maybe that might be the case, but really only for a few people but they're, you know, because I do write a lot about, you know… the game. Playing the game right and so people are wondering is this fool going to win the game or is he going to lose again. I kind of set myself up as that character and so we'll see what the end game is here.
GGRMS: This is a question that I always had written down but I never asked because I didn't want to cross that personal threshold, but seeing as though you have put that behind you. What was your day job?
Glenn Donaldson: Oh, I worked for a nonprofit that supports the national parks in the Bay Area.
GGRMS :Oh nice.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah. So yeah, t was a good mission and but it has the same ups and downs as any job but ultimately the mission was to support the parks and create trails and and restorative plants and stuff like that so I was raising money for that. I felt like this is a good mission if I have to be involved in in capitalism.
GGRMS: Was there a job, let's say within the theme of Life in The Void that was just the absolute worst thing you ever had to do?
Glenn Donaldson: I've had a lot of different jobs, and I've everything from digging ditches to working in a factory to being a delivery person to working in restaurants I've literally done like every kind of job. I worked in a sticker factory one summer for like a month and that was really miserable, mainly because they would last like horrible music while you're working. And, and I'm such a music person that that was like literally torture for me. Yeah, it was offensive. It was like some horrible radio station that the manager picked and I'd be sitting there, pushing a card around filling it up with like different supplies to like print stickers and it was just, it was, it was like industrial stickers like warning stickers for like toxic waste or something. Right. We can do a whole podcast on all the shitty jobs I've had in my life. People always like shit on delivery people jobs but one of my best jobs was being a pizza delivery person in Santa Cruz like that's one of my most cherished memories as an employee.
GGRMS: Well, in my experience they could have some pretty good stories too. The random the amount of doors opening to you while delivering pizzas, must present some interesting situations.
Glenn Donaldson: I ended up leaving because the supervisor changed… but at first we had a good a good manager, and they provided us with vehicles. So there wasn't that stress of having to like use your own car which everyone seems to do now. They had like an official pizza delivery vehicles and the one we'd always fight over was like a giant Oldsmobile. And it was just really fun to drive like a giant low rider looking car. And so yeah, I don't know we just had a fun time and it was a crazy adventure of trying to navigate Santa Cruz mountains to deliver pizza and it was just a wacky fun job.
GGRMS: Can we talk about the song, Here Comes The Lunar Hand? Prior to hearing the song I wasn't aware of the term lunar hand. Looking it up revealed that it's a term in palmistry. That could mean that there's like good fortune ahead of you or perhaps love. Can you tell me where it falls within the context of the song because it does seem like it's somewhat open to interpretation.
Glenn Donaldson: I didn't even know that that's what lunar hand man meant. I just I wrote that those lyrics totally stream of consciousness and I was thinking of lunar hand is like the power of the moon. How it influences astrology how I don't know, just like this hand of fate or something. Maybe I did read that somewhere as in relation to tarot but It just that came out of my random. You know at some point I was working on a project with my friend Clay who plays piano on some Reds, Pines and Purples…. I was writing some lyrics for him actually for something else he was doing and I just filled up an entire document of just me ranting weird phrases and things. Most of that song came from that. So I know sometimes when I write, I really don't know what I'm writing about.,but I feel like that that one's kind of like, reckoning with whether or not you have free will or not or something. Sometimes I get sick of the songs that are, you know, because I do write a lot of songs about, insider sports versions of what it's like to be an artist or an indie rocker or whatever, or have a label. But at the same time. Half of the song, I could have been thinking about that and the other half I could have been thinking about having a relationship with someone and how that can fall apart, like Break Up The Band is on on that record (The Town That Cursed Your Name) is is really about a relationship. It's not necessarily about a band but it definitely applies to a band.
GGRMS: Well, I mean, as long as there's been bands, people have made the comparison that bands are like marriages and in some ways, perhaps more difficult there's because there's more than two people usually.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, I'm just a generally music obsessed person so I view the world through the lens of music. So it's often it's just a metaphor for trying to navigate human connection and and finding meaning in your life. But sometimes it is literally about the music world, just because it's I find that it's ripe for satire and critique also, and celebration.
GGRMS:The track Burning Sunflowers, you must get an award for using the term a “cumulus cloud”. I didn't pick it up until I actually read the lyrics but it's a that's a great line. And just as a tangent to that, when I received my Summer At Land’s End double vinyl, you've got that beautiful sunflower imagery on it and then the vinyl itself was that matching yellow just like the Sunflowers. You use so many flowers in your imagery and I know it has to do with your neighborhood.,but is there also a connection there to something else?
Glenn Donaldson: Sunflowers are my favorite flower and that something about them is just, they're just so epic and there's there's ones that grow here that just are enormous and they're they're big. As you know there are many classic paintings of sunflowers of course, Van Gogh of course. He painted that famous sunflower painting right? They’re magical flowers aren't they? They grow really well up here and certain times a year like late summer you'll see an insane burst of sunflowers somewhere and it just… I think that song, I don't know what that was about either…. Let's see,
…”hope you never change, I think of you this way. Glint of sunlight on your face. A cumulus cloud and the shape it takes…. “
Yeah, I write too many songs about tragedies and failures and overcoming that. And sometimes you get this urge to write something that's really romantic and, and, you know, those moments when you stumble on a field of flowers with you and you're out on a hike with your friends or you have this moment with someone you have a crush on and you just, it's just that beautiful rush of images of memories of wonderful times and, and how that's still possible and in any phase of life to kind of appreciate the beauty of things.
GGRMS: In our last conversation, I think it was our last conversation we brought up the fact that there could be many different interpretations to the name Reds, Pinks and Purples. And of course, as a writer, or a songwriter, once your song is out there, your listeners might interpret things differently as well. And so, I think my interpretation or what I pulled from the lyrics was that these burning sunflowers in the summer heat were sort of akin to like the, the ones that are hurt from these broken relationships or like the ones left behind …we all leave a trail of hurt people behind us.
Glenn Donaldson: I'm open to all interpretations of the stuff I read. I see the, I see the wildest interpretations online in the reviews. And I think, yeah, that sounds good too. But yeah, you know, specifically, as we're talking about this is taking me back to this time that I was on a hike in Northern California, probably somewhere near Point Reyes, which is just north of here. And it was really hot and there was like this field of like dried flowers and there was like sunflowers that were kind of, you know, they burst into these giant faces of, of, of energy. And then the service as the summer starts to burn them, they get really crispy looking. And I just remember this field was so hot and you could hear the teeming insects and the, and sort of the crunching of, of dried foliage. And so I think that's where that I was calling thinking back to that image of the burning sunflowers. They're like literally burning in the summer heat as they decay and they become really dried but they're still incredibly beautiful. . Even as they die and decay, they're just as beautiful as when they bloom.
GGRMS: You had mentioned before that the songs on this album encompasses the struggle of the indie artist and labels. Having started a small label recently myself (Petit Village Records),this track, sort of hit home as I struggled to find what proper shipping rates are etc.. There was a time listening to this album where I couldn't even listen to that song because I didn't even want to consider the failure of a record label.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, but some of the labels that failed are some of the best ever. It's true. I think that's probably like better left to like hindsight in that experience. You don't want to go through the downfall of the label but maybe like removed you can say, oh, I did a fair job or at least put out some half decent things. Starting a label is what's called a fool's errand. You know that term. It is.
GGRMS: In fact, I've gone into it with the idea that this is just how I'm going to occupy my time for the next 20 years.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, and you look at it that way. If you look at it as like, this is something beautiful that I'm doing, but the rest of the world might not think it's beautiful. Then you're fine. And then if you accidentally stumble on an artist who's successful, they will be immediately poached by another label.
GGRMS:: Exactly. it's like Bob Dylan's drummers…
Glenn Donaldson: To be a real label, you have to have a certain kind of stamina that the casual person couldn't conjure.
GGRMS: Right. Well, I think one of the labels that you're on, Slumberland , is a good example of the lwherewithal that someone needs, and the right choices, I guess. You also have your own digital imprint. Is that right? Burundi Cloud?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, that's just all my other projects that aren't Reds, Pink, and Purples. It's not really, I mean, I guess, yeah, I've never made any merchandise. All this stuff was, some of it was released through other labels, but I just control the digital on the bandcamp.
GGRMS: As a fan of music and someone who's aware of like perhaps the business end of it from being a kid listening to Hüsker Dü, up into present day as an artist, do you think that there was ever a sweet spot within the industry to be a musician? Do you think there was ever a time where it worked for everyone?
Glenn Donaldson: I mean, every artist, is like a cog in the machine. There's good and bad things about all the different eras, I think the era when we're in now, if you have the jams, if you have the songs and you can manage to get a hold of a laptop and a few bits of equipment, you can really get in the game. Whereas, before you could be involved in what they called lo-fi… with a cassette recorder or reel-to-reel, but rarely would that stuff compete with what gets played on the radio, if at all. I mean, that would be just kind of unheard of. Whereas now, if people can gather their small amount of equipment, they can actually compete with professional recording. So that is a good thing. With my music, I make it here at my desk and it gets played on the radio, like mainstream radio, and not just, you know, a podcast or whatever, which is incredible to me. That would have been impossible before. And that's due to the advancement of digital, technology. And then the access, anyone can release anything and potentially have, you know, millions of people listening to it. But obviously, that's a small percentage of artists, but that access is there… there's no gatekeeper there. What really drove me to start my own, dumb little labels and put out my own tapes was because even the indie labels were gatekeeping and they didn't want me. Like when SST record started, because no one wanted to release a Black Flag record, that's like totally ridiculous, right? Because Black Flag is like one of the best bands of all time. Just think of the talent that was going into that band and the art and everything else. And he had to start his own label. So if you have something that's really good and people are gatekeeping you, just do it yourself. And that's easy to do now. So easy.
GGRMS: I recently spoke to someone who is in a successful band from the 90s still going today and they achieved commercial success and whatnot, over like 30 years. But it doesn't sound that they're any better off for having that experience in 2024. I feel like today's artists like yourself probably have a better grasp on how to survive as a musician than some of these people that were sort of trapped within old systems, I guess, or maybe still in that mindset.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, that's interesting. I mean, I've kind of, I've always been an under the radar type artist and kept up with where the new outlets are and what the new tech is. And yeah, if you're used to getting an advance from a label and going to a studio and going through that system, you might have trouble adapting to how things are now, which is all about Soundcloud and TikTok and Bandcamp. So I could see that. And also they probably feel like, you know, to some extent, some of the glamour has been kicked out of it. You know, the before you'd sign to label and you get a check for $20,000. That would be a small record deal. A $20,000 advance would be a small deal. I haven't gotten an advance for any Reds, Pinks and Purples music. I think how many songs I've created and how many records I put out, and no one's ever offered to pay for my recording costs.
GGRMS: I was going to say the equivalent of that now is someone swooping in and offering to just release it, like noticing.
Glenn Donaldson: You know that's a big deal. Yeah. If someone actually wants to put your stuff on viny… say yes, go for it.
GGRMS: I want to bring up the track I Still Owe You Everything, which I don't think has seen an official release on an album yet. If I'm not mistaken, I was just curious what the status of that.
Oh, you know that I think that one's on something. God, I'd have to look it up. I think it's on that bonus CD that came with one of the records. Okay. But but I'm not sure. No, wait, because I did look at the track listing for the new album coming out and Wishing Well and I was expecting to see it on there. I'm going to lose track because I now have so many songs. I still owe you everything. That's on The Town That Cursed Your Name.. You're thinking of f No One Absolves Us In The End. Yeah, you're thinking of the that one, it hasn't come out. Yeah, I did those around the same time. I don't know. I forgot about that one. That's also that's one that gets a lot of… I put that on a lot of like mixes and stuff. There's something about that song., I intend to put it on something. I just I guess never got around to it. I totally forgot it. The prolific thing is daunting because I do forget about songs because I write and record them and I just really want to move on so I can come up with new ideas. The ones I tend to remember, are the ones maybe I've taught to the band and we've played them a few times.
GGRMS: Speaking of the band, you guys are heading off to Europe soon, right?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, June, we have a bunch of stuff going on. We have. We're going to play like a little two night residency in Minneapolis in April and then we have an almost three week tour of two week tour of the UK. Nice. So how do we have we have some stuff after that, but I can't announce it yet.
GGRMS: So how do you go about choosing what your set list or the potential songs to play is given that you've released like six albums in five years. And none of these fans have heard.any of these songs live before.
Glenn Donaldson: I was thinking about this because I wish we had more time to just learn a lot of songs, but really have to be realistic and the band has their things they need to do in their personal life and it really is down to me. Sorting through it all. You know, a lot of it started off as data driven, to be honest, I just looked at what people were listening to and the most and I started making the list that way. And then so I picked the like top songs that people were in, you know, clicking on. And then I also just picked some random ones for myself that no one, no one's even heard yet, I you know, feel like doing myself. And so there are a couple deep cuts and then some songs no one's heard that I play live. But yeah, they're they're like my top. I went to the top 10 top 20 songs on Spotify and just, because I don't I honestly don't know. I mean, I write these songs and I go, I kind of get a sense that this one or that one might be better than another one. They're all kind of the same to me. So yeah, and it's nice for me to let the audience take ownership of them.
GGRMS:Well, it's also cool that you let the band kind of take ownership of them to it with some of the live recordings that you've released of some songs that you recorded originally solo. They are sort of like pushed through a different lens or you know the band brings a different feel to it.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, that's a really nice filter. So I do introduce a bunch of songs in rehearsal and the one that they kind of really gravitate towards that's what I'll pick that one. So they kind of decide what we play by just how they bring it to life.
GGRMS: The track Break Up The Band, you brought it up before… And I'd like to point out the fact that it's a piano ballad. Given the rest of your your back catalog, why did this song call for the piano? And can you describe how it took shape because it does stand out.
Glenn Donaldson: I think I have pretensions of being a crooner. And I always wanted to like make records that sound like Scott Walker. You know, he's one of my favorites. Scott Walker 3… I'm obsessed with that record and I'd love to sing with an orchestra and with a piano. I got my start singing as a kid singing stuff from musicals. So I kind of am still really drawn to that, the sort of, you know, really melodic over the top kind of crooner songs ballads I got Clay to come up with some piano for me and we just sort of kick the chords back and forth. And yeah, it came together really fast. He threw down a bunch of chords, and I just had him rearrange the chords, maybe I put it in a different key. I already had those lyrics, I just kind of adapted them to the to the piano. We've actually done that like three times now and it's kind of worked out really well. Yeah, at some point I'd love to like, yeah, just do do a piano record piano and vocals, maybe strings. I think what really adds to the effect of that song is the fact that it's your voice and the piano.
GGRMS: And you, you know, you're talking about breaking up the band there's something so isolated about that. The sound that it just reinforces the idea of like the band is dead. I mean, very effective.
Glenn Donaldson: I realize that putting the way I sing putting that against something really stark like that is going to be kind of melodramatic and so yeah, I'm totally, you know, hammering it up there, I guess. I realize that like, you know, I realize that people would rather hear you know shoe gaze music but yeah, I want to make some piano ballads.
GGRMS: I feel like there's room for that within The Reds, Pinks and Purples’ catalog, given that you've always, or you're starting to balance the dynamic between a solo and band. What I found interesting about the lyric in Break Up The Band, was describing the feeling of the ship hitting the sand , you know, everything stops, this is where you break up the band…and then the idea that Reds, Pinks and Purples was so solitary, a solo effort …. but now you're slowly becoming a band…
Glenn Donaldson: You know,, there's sort of a sequel to that song on the new record called Learning To Love A Band, which is the opposite. It's like, it's like where you, you're becoming enamored of the idea of a band again and again it's not just about a band but it's about life. But you know, I want to say about the ship imagery is like whenever, if you've ever been in a tour van or you've been on tour you do feel like you're on a ship and, and it's that like cabin fever, you know it's like shipmates, you know, and you're kind of like at war together or you're at sea together and it's like, you know, eventually the ship hits the sandbar and you all just have to like escape, you know. Right. Build those walls up temporarily. Yeah, let's let's get out as get off this, this crazy boat.
GGRMS: During our first conversation, which would have been three years ago,…you had turned me on to both the band Cindy and the band April Magazine. And since then I've been able to follow them. Over, over the course of the last couple of years. Can you talk about your relationship with those bands? On the release Murder, Oral Sex and Cigarettes you dedicate Generator Shows to those bands.
Glenn Donaldson: During the pandemic, both Cindy and April Magazine were setting up and playing these shows at a secret location under an overpass. And they were bringing a generator. And it's kind of tucked away in the middle of a park. But not that many people pass through this underpass area. It's kind of a trail that goes under this freeway. So, there's cars on top. So it's covered by foliage and then the noise of the, of the freeway. You would never know there was bands playing under there. And. And they both have a kind of that slow kind of Velvet Underground influence sound. And so I kind of made a song that, that reminded me of both those bands and also just that experience of seeing bands play under the overpass. So that song, that kind of slow. velvety chord progression. And so it's just kind of like a nice memory of like that sort of early pandemic times when people could only see and meet in the middle of a park somewhere.
GGRMS: Were they sort of a standout in that not a lot of people were doing that sort of thing?
Glenn Donaldson: That's the only thing that I was aware of that I wanted to see, I guess. They'd have two or three bands each time and all the shows were amazing. Bands from the East Bay came and, you know, it's all secret. Like no one could advertise it because the police would come shut it down. It's not a sanctioned event, but it's just off the beaten path. So no one noticed it. Those are always the best musical experiences.
GGRMS: I want to talk about cover songs… because you're also not shy of putting out your own version of somebody else's song and as a music fan, they're always fun. It not only shows a side of the artists, you know, like maybe musical listening tendencies or inspiration, but it's always interesting to see how they would spin it their own way. And you've worked on a couple of great covers over the last couple of years. Are you working on any new ones that you would care to share with us?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, I like doing covers because I feel like I have a sort of limited style that I do. Like my, the universe of what The Reds, Pinks and Purples can do musically is, and my voice is pretty limited. So if I can actually perform a song, it's going to end up sounding like me. Those are always my favorite covers is when people take, especially when you take something that's pretty different from the way how you sound. And you kind of warp it into your style. I’m Trying to think of an artist that's like that…like Low, like if you think about Low. When they do a cover and, they've done some cool ones over time, like they do Transmission. Probably my favorite cover of a Joy Division song and you can picture exactly what it's going to sound like because you know that Low has such a distinct style. So it's just, you know, it's going to be really slow and it's going to have the male female vocals. Yeah, so that's my approach. Galaxy 500. That's another good example where they do, you know, George Harrison and they do Yoko Ono. They just do great Ceremony. Their version of Ceremony is incredible. So yeah, it's just this idea of ….can I make it sound like me and sort of change the context of where the song is from? What am I working on now? I've kind of kicked around a bunch, but I haven't, recorded anything. Occasionally I'll just stumble on something that I think I can play and usually I realize I can't play it at all. They have to be really simple because I can't adapt my style to anything complicated. Like something like Mazzy Star, which I do Common Burn, that's a home run for me because there's only three chords in a Mazzy Star song at most. Yeah, I don't know. I'd have to think. Let me think. I mean, I'm always doing Lana Del Ray songs. I've done two so far, and I've probably done five, but only two that I've released. I just really relate to her songwriting and her choice of chords is not so different from mine because she uses, you know, the classic, girl groups and singer songwriter chords. Which is what I do too.
GGRMS: Your version of Lana Del Rey’s … Did you Know There’s A Tunnel Under Ocean Boulevard came on in the car while we were taking a road trip. My daughter's mind was blown. She knew the song, but it wasn't the song she knew. It was very cool.
Glenn Donaldson: Did she like it?
GGRMS: She did like it, yeah.
Glenn Donaldson: That's good. I don't know what people who are fans of hers would think of my versions. I have no idea. But you know, actually when we played in Richmond, Virginia last summer, we were on tour opening for Destroyer and there was some young people that came that were there because of the Lana Del Rey cover and they were disappointed that we didn't play it. Just funny. Oh, it is funny. I mean, that's I guess like 2024 and the internet. People can now stumble upon one song online and go to show just for that cover.
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, I mean, I think they checked out the other stuff too, but that was their way in… which exactly that's exactly what I wanted it to do. I also think I was kind of trolling a bit too, because I know there's this type of like record collector music snob that's like, “oh, Lana Del Rey, that's just like mainstream garbage” or something. No, this is really great stuff so I'm kind of like, I don't know, drawing a line in the sand saying I really love that music. And if you don't, you know, you're silly, you're just being silly. I mean, I totally get someone not liking Lana Del Rey. I just mean like, it's not a icool reference to make, and I'm tired of ..,.I'm really over like “coolness” in music. I just have no interest in it.
GGRMS: Well, I heard your version of Ghosts Again before I heard the original, which is a Depeche Mode song, right?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, that's a new Depeche, brand new Depeche Mode. From the last album, I like was unaware of it, and went back to it.
GGRMS: I actually saw their last tour, which was like incredible. But that cover is a bold move.
Glenn Donaldson: I also like to tackle the big single of the new album, it was a total accident too. I loved that song from the moment I heard it. I have not been paying attention to Depeche Mode, what they've done the last, you know, since the 90s, I have no idea what they've been up to, even though I think I'm sure there's amazing stuff in there because they're so talented. The classics, which I love, you know, the classic era, whatever Personal Jesus and Violator. Music for the masses. Oh man, I love those records. But now I'm really curious to investigate all their other stuff because I just happened to hear that new song, I just was obsessed with it…and I realized it's co written by Richard Butler, who's Psychedelic Furs are a huge influence on Reds, Pinks and Purples…. not that many people pointed it out but occasionally someone will say “Oh, I can tell you're you're ripping offPsychedelic Furs” and I and I'm like “100%”. I love Psychedelic Furs and they're totally underrated. Richard Butler is one of my favorite singers. I love his weird random lyric poetry and the melodies are just, they're just the most solid band, every record is good. I saw him live two a few years ago and it and it sounded like just as good as the old stuff it was incredible. His voice still sounds amazing. But why did I get on that Oh, he co-wrote that song with for Depeche Mode. I'm a huge Richard Butler fan so of course I like this to Mode song.. it's a Richard Butler song. I feel like a lot of people use covers to as like a sign of like how cool their record collection is or something. Like there are approved bands that you can cover like you can cover the Velvet Underground you can cover say, Wire or something. There's not enough people covering, you know, a new Depeche Mode song so, I'll just be that person.I think that music is incredible, if you were to dip in to their last five albums, They are probably full of incredible songs. Maybe the production isn't what you think it should be. But there's definitely really good, you know, art in there. I'm like an underground noise guy or whatever. And here I am. I can interpret these like amazing pop songs. It's just fun to put them in the context of what I do.
GGRMS: Is there a song, that as a music fan you wish you had written? One song that you just have always felt connected to.
Glenn Donaldson: There's so many. I mean, really, even me even making music is just an extension of being a fan of music and wanting to be part of the game. Speaking of Psychedelic Furs, Pretty in Pink, I wish I wrote that song. It's like one of the best songs ever or, you know, anything by the Go-Betweens, or Leonard Cohen, I just like the perfection of his rhymes and his writing. Yeah, everyone's talking about Tracy Chapman‘s Fast Car.. That is like literally, I think one of the most perfect songs ever written the guitar riff, the lyrics. I wish I wrote Fast Car. That's amazing song. I’m just I'm an appreciator of song craft. And, you know, it's high art to make songs on that level that can move that many people.
GGRMS: Let’s shift to the instrumentals on the release We Can’t All Be Herores.. The track Park Chalet. I have to mention…. also Glenn, that last time we spoke I think I had mentioned that the accompanying instrumental album to Summer At Land's End, Mountain View, Lake, …
Glenn Donaldson: That's actually the location of those shows I was talking about. The generator shows. Yeah, it's somewhere near there.
GGRMS: This became a bit of a safety blanket of sorts …the last last year or two with the the label, I'd be waking up in the middle of the night and having anxiety, I’d put this on and just sort of like drift back into sleep. And subsequently every instrumental release that you've put out since has replaced the last one, as far as those late night listening sessions. So thank you for those because I guess they were filling a void. No pun intended that I, I didn't know I needed. Park Chalet sonically stands out amongst your instrumentals. It's very orchestral. Can you talk about composing that track and how did you go about recording it.
Glenn Donaldson: One of my big purchases last year is a sampling keyboard based on the Melotron. And it's like mini version of the Melotron. It s the cheapest one they have, it was actually kind of expensive for me. But I needed a new keyboard that wasn't just software. And this one has knobs on it. It's kind of fun. So, I mean that's all that song is is a loop. I just looped an orchestral sounding riff on a loop pedal and then I just improvised the melody over top. Just did it in one take.
GGRMS: I've noticed in the subsequent instrumental releases, you're kind of exploring textures or colors that aren't present in your songs featuring lyrics and voice. .I'm wondering about the dynamic between composing those two different types of songs.
Glenn Donaldson: Well, making instrumental songs is much easier than writing songs with lyrics and vocal melodies. With lyrics and ,melodies, the music has to really only enhance what I'm singing. I think that's the case with most music, but if the music doesn't support the singing, it's not going to be that, you know, classic for me. I don't know, it's possible to have singing that's more just another instrument, but I'm not as interested in that kind of music. Occasionally, it's something I listen to, but not only does it have to support the singing, the melody, but also the tone. The tone of your voice, like where it sits in the mix. So, yeah, that limits what you can do musically to things that support the singing. And then when you take that away, then the music can go in all these different directions. You can have all these extra melodies and hooks that because you can't have necessarily guitar part that clashes with what the singer is singing. You can sometimes… sometimes it works, but you take the vocals away and then the guitar could become the singer, the Casio could become the singer, the melodica, you know, that fills in that role. So, yeah, there's a lot more freedom and instrumental stuff to me is that's just throw away. I don't even put any effort into it. I just get inspired to like make some wallpaper music and I just want to like noodle around on the keyboards and guitar and some, you know, that's just what I do for fun. The lyric songs are take a lot more work and effort. But I do love instrumental music. I think just what you're saying, I use music to take naps and to work and stuff. So I wanted to have some part of the catalog be available to people who sort of liked my musical style, but didn't want to listen to singing.
GGRMS: I don't know how many like, you know, rem journeys I went on to listening to Stoned Wanderer…
Glenn Donaldson: Songs like Stoned Wanderer…those are totally designed to like be sleep inducing. I cherish those albums that are like good for that. You know what I mean? Like Durutti Column, especially or yeah, Roy Montgomery solo records, certain like, I guess new age stuff, you know, especially he's the king of that or a lot of the Japanese stuff that's like, just lovely environmental music. I love that style.
GGRMS: I wanted to talk about the track The World Should Be Ashamed. It too has become a bit of a meditation as of late. It's hard not to attach that song with everything that's going on in the world today, but I'm wondering if maybe this song has a different meaning for you.
Glenn Donaldson: I’d have to review the lyrics to know which one that is. …I know the song…but the world should be ashamed for treating you this way. Yeah, I don't remember what what is the context of that is….The world should constantly be ashamed. I mean, think of how they treat human beings and but it's also probably about how everyone feels like they're under attack, you know, we're made to feel like we're under attack all the time. If you follow, any kind of media.
GGRMS: I should have mentioned this with the covers, but the track Only Life Of Fun... I was listening to that quite a bit lately and I was unaware that that was a cover and, then was pleasantly directed towards The Moving Targets..
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah. So moving targets are a Boston band. They come from the hardcore era, like, like early 80s. And then they kind of make their masterpiece, Burning In Water. And that's, I think mid 80s that comes out by 85-86 they kind of have the Boston sound which is influenced by Mission of Burma. The cover I do is actually on the third record, which is a really good one the first three albums you can't go wrong but especially that first one is is hands down a classic… catchy, Moission Of Burma meets Hüsker Dü sounding record, really great harmony vocals and awesome rhythm section. But that's Kenny Chambers and I just was such a fan when I was in high school. I actually ended up communicating with him on Facebook. And I was like, “I did a cover of your song”. Actually, he helped me with the lyrics. Before I covered it I wrote to him saying I couldn't understand some of the lyrics I, and he then sent me the lyrics. He said “Send it to me when you're finished”. I was super embarrassed to send it to him, I just couldn't do it. I just didn't want to know what he thought of it, you know, but then finally I got the courage and said, “Kenny, I did your song, here it is. If you don't like it, don't tell me you don't like it”. And he's like, “Oh, I already heard it. I love it.” He said he thought it was better than the original, I don't know if he's just being nice, but that's cool. Like, you know, he's one of my favorites from that era. So that was really cool to like interact with him.
GGRMS: As a young man in Southern California, did you ever get to see that band perform?
Glenn Donaldson: I don't know how often they came to the West Coast in that era. I never got to see him, but anyone listening (reading) should listen to that first Moving Targets record and tell me it's not amazing.
GGRMS: Did you ever get the chance to see Hüsker dü?
Glenn Donaldson: I was a little too young. But you know, when I was just about show going age, they were on their last tour for warehouse songs and stories. They were playing in Los Angeles, which is, you know, a little bit of far, far from where I grew up in Southern California. So, I tried to get a ride. I couldn't drive yet and I couldn't get a ride. That still burns me up because Warehouse is my favorite album and that was the tour. And I had the flyer and everything and I just, yeah, I couldn't go because I just didn't get a couldn't, you know, no driver's license yet.
GGRMS: There's a future song in there. The time you didn't get to see Hüsker Dü.
Glenn Donaldson: Hüsker Dü who's like my favorite band. I mean, They broke up right after that, like literally like a couple months after that.
GGRMS: So being a diehard Hüsker Dü fan, how did you feel about because the break up? The idea that part of the process or the lifespan of being a fan of pop music or rock music… is the eventual break up? How did you feel about Sugar following.?
Glenn Donaldson: Well, I've gone back recently and listened to the Bob Mould solo, the first two and I really like them now I didn't like them as a kid, but now as a bitter middle aged man they make perfect sense. And I love the sound like, back then they were a little too slick for me probably like, and that was when I was getting into, you know, Sonic youth and no wave and noise and noise rock and stuff. It was a little too like, you know, middle of the road for me but now I love it. And I totally missed Sugar. I wasn't even really listening to that kind of music when that came out I was listening to really experimental stuff I got into like, you know, listening to like Pharoah Sanders and The Falll and got into noise. I wasn't listening to melodic rock but now I've gone back actually just like this year and finally heard Sugar and yeah it's really great I like it a lot. It's funny to hear him because Hüsker Dü were such innovators, they created a sound that people copied. Everyone from My Bloody Valentine to Nirvana owes Hüsker Dü, you know, they really influence people but then when Sugar comes around…. He kind of sounds a little bit like bands that were influenced by him. Like he sounds a little like The Pixies and maybe touch of My Bloody Valentine and it's really funny to hear. Yeah, it's like they he swaps places with his people who he influenced. . His super slick production choices. I think I only realized as an older person going back and listening to them but they sound really crisp and professional to a fault almost like they're almost too clean or too poppy but I'm that was clearly a reaction of trying to do something different than what he was doing before like completely flip it on its side.
GGRMS: I made a note about the track. Did You Put Your Song Up Today?, which I think I probably originally got from Bandcamp and then I received as part of the seven inch bonus that came withThe Town That Cursed Your Name. The track has got me thinking about how I used to line up outside a record store before it opened for a release day of an album, , or I would skip class in CEGEP, which is like a pre-college here, to go buy a new record, the day it came out. And today we order these albums months in advance online through let's say Bandcamp and receive it, you know, down the road. Whereas once I used to get out of bed and physically go somewhere now. The email from the artist or the label comes to me. The point is, we may have lost a little bit of the romance of receiving the artifact or that that engagement of purchasing it. But I feel the connection of ordering the music from the artist themselves is more intimate. Can you talk about the connection between a physical artifact as an artist versus a digital version ?
Glenn Donaldson: You know, I guess as a fan, I really like to get a CD, you know, because I've been getting into going back into my old CDs lately. I got a new CD player a little while back, like in the middle of the pandemic. And I just, I just realized I liked CDs and I like vinyl too. But probably it kind of came of age when CDs were coming in and so yeah, I'll buy these CDs. They're like $1.99 because no one's buying them because they can just stream it, right? Because it's not that much different. But you know, I just enjoy actually having a CD and like poking around my pile of CDs and looking at the cover. And it makes, makes the action of listening more deliberate. And when I'm really into an album and sometimes they're not even on streaming, I have to like track down a cheap CD and I don't know. Yeah, it's just a much more pleasurable experience as a fan. But as a person who puts out records, I actually don't care that much. I'm happy that my stuff lands on vinyl, but I'm kind of just into putting up songs when I feel like putting them up because you have to wait so long to get stuff manufactured and then there's delays and you get filtered through the labels and dealing with that. I just, I don't, it doesn't inspire me. I really enjoy the direct. That's what kind of that song is about. That Did You Put Your Song Up Today? I think it's a parody of like, of being an obsessive of like putting up a song and yeah, how many people listen to my song and that certain neurotic feeling of getting judged by people and I just, I really like Bandcamp and how direct it is. It's like, I have a direct channel and like, I can put something up and people can connect with it almost immediately. It's just amazing. I mean, that's another thing about the change in the music industry is like how rapid I can come up with an idea and just get really excited about it and like realize the dream. And then I have this actual song and I can get people listening to it in a matter of hours. It's just completely, you know, space age, right? And in some way, depending on how prolific you are and adept at putting your music up on a Bandcamp, you can sort of trickle stuff out that in some way might be able to pay forward into your next project. I think I'm undervaluing it and not, you know, sitting on a pile of songs and and making like vinyl releases and doing all the promotion but at the same time I just I really like how I can make songs into postcards… like I'm mailing out a postcard, and I don't have to wait around and getting neurotic about, …oh, is this album a classic or not. that stuff is just troublesome for people who make music. At least it is for me. I get really insecure about what I do. And if I just cut out the middleman of dealing with a vinyl release or promotions, then I can just be like, there it is. Check it out. You can love it or hate it. There's been no investment on your part. It's free. You know, and the amazing thing is is and people have responded with such warmth, that's moving to me. You know, because I know a lot of people put their heart on their sleeve and get ignored and and I have like a little audience now and I'm just so grateful that people can get on my level and be like, yeah, I really understand what you're singing about here. Or this song means something to me, you know, it's still kind of shocking.
GGRMS: Can you tell us a little bit about the forthcoming album and Wishing Well. Is it the same cast of players? Can you give us the when’s and where’s of the writing and recording?
Glenn Donaldson: Yeah, I mean all the records I've done are pretty much solo albums in terms of the studio and this is no exception. It's, I do all the studio work myself. There's a couple of guest appearances on it from people in the band who play guitar, the guitarists appear… so they're mostly, I guess 99% me. Thomas plays guitar on one and Lou plays a little guitar and on another one. But I feel like that's going to change because we now have a space where I'm going to bring some of my recording gear. So I'm going to try to get more of a session feel going on where we were I capture what the band is doing. I'm really excited about that because I have enough gear that I think it's going to actually be comparable to a pretty great studio sound. I have high hopes for kind of utilizing the band more because they really can do something I can't do, which is nice. And I'm kind of a little bit. I feel like maybe I've done this sound enough. Yeah, so that one I recorded. So the record label in the UK Tough Love was like, “can we get an album of all new material and it won't be stuff you just release on a Bandcamp like all the time?”. So I consciously made an album that's all new and it's all kind of ended up recording like 25 songs for it and and cutting it down to 10. I think it's 10. And people like it. I think it's got a different feel because you know, I concentrated on making it all one piece, it's less of a rock album, more of a singer songwriter album, and has has elements of all the things I've done. I concentrated on making the vocals more present and using a little less sort of trickery in terms of like reverb and things like that. It's interesting to see how people react. I mean, I was definitely going through a hard time when I wrote it, I was kind of dealing with some loss in my life. So there's a lot of like songs about grieving and loss that, you know, but it's still filtered through the same topics that I always tackle. So there's, there's a little bit of everything in it. It's hard to say. It's the kind of thing what I was saying before about sitting on material for too long. It’s really is vexing to me. So I don't know what I think of it. I know that it's not as rockin as The Town That Cursed Your Name or Uncommon Weather.It's not really a singles record. People are going to have to hear the whole thing. I feel like it's a, it's an album album, not an album of like bangers, you know, I look forward to it and it comes out April 12.
GGRMS: We'll be dropping the needle on it. Ican't thank you enough. This has been a very fruitful conversation. I Really appreciate the fact that you gave me two interview sessions. As always, whenever I go back and I prepare for interviewing you, it's always a gift, I always find out a little bit more about you. There's always a song that I didn't realize was a cover and it sends me in the direction of a new band to get into. There's other gifts that come from being a fan of your music, other than just your music. So we thank you.
Glenn Donaldson:Yeah, I feel like my I'm also a cheerleader like, like my job is to like, you know, turn people on to like records they forgot about or had never heard in the first place or, you know, I love turning people on to music that's like one of my joys.
GGRMS: Right on. Thank you so much, Glenn.
Since the original broadcast of this interview, The Reds, Pinks & Purples have released the following albums…